>> GOOD AFTERNOON, WELCOME.
MY NAME IS JEFF REZNICK, CHIEF
OF THE HISTORY DIVISION AT THE
LIBRARY OF MEDICINE.
THANK YOU FOR JOINING US AS WE
CONTINUE OUR 2022 SERIES OF ALL
VIRTUAL NLM HISTORY TALKS FOR
THOSE ON TWITTER THANKS FOR
FOLLOWING ALONG USING THE
HASHTAG NLMHIST TALK.
PROMOTING COLLECTIONS FOR
RESEARCH, EDUCATION AND PUBLIC
SERVICE AND BIOMEDICINE, SOCIAL
SCIENCES AND HUMANITIES.
THE SERIES ALSO SUPPORTS THE
COMMITMENT OF THE NLM TO
RECOGNIZE THE DIVERSITY OF ITS
COLLECTIONS, WHICH SPAN TEN
CENTURIES ENCOMPASS A RANGE OF
DIGITAL AND PHYSICAL FORMATS AND
ORIGINATE FROM NEARLY EVERY PART
OF THE GLOBE.
THE SERIES ALSO DEMONSTRATES THE
COMMITMENT OF THE LIBRARY TO
FOREGROUND VOICES OF PEOPLE OF
COLOR WOMEN AND INDIVIDUALS OF A
VARIETY OF CULTURAL AND
DISCIPLINARY BACKGROUNDS WHO
VALUE THESE COLLECTIONS AND USE
THEM TO ADVANCE THE RESEARCH,
THEIR TEACHING AND THEIR
LEARNING.
WE SUPPLEMENT NLM HISTORY TALKS
WITH SPEAKERS BLOGS CIRCULATING
NOW AT CIRCULATING NOW.GOV AND
IT'S MADE POSSIBLE BY AN
OUTSTANDING TEAM HERE AT THE NIH
HISTORY OF NLM AND VIDEO CASTING
AND I'D LIKE TO THANK THEM FOR
BRINGING THIS SERIES TO YOU, THE
PUBLIC.
BEFORE I INTRODUCE THE SPEAKER
TODAY I'D LIKE TO INTRODUCE YOU
TO THE NEXT TALK OFFERED BY
PATRICIA PALMA A PROFESSOR IN
CHILÉ.
JOIN US ON THURSDAY MARCH 17TH
AT 2:00 P.M. EASTERN TIME TO
HEAR DR. PALMA SPEAK ON GEORGE
DEACON THE CIRCULATION OF
HOMEOPATHIC THERAPIES IN PERU
1880 TO 1915.
TODAY I HAVE THE GREAT PLEASURE
AND PRIVILEGE OF INTRODUCING
DR. DIERDRE COOPER OWENS, THE
CHARLES AND LINDA WILSON
PROFESSOR IN THE HISTORY OF
MEDICINE AND DIRECTOR OF THE
HUMANITIES IN MEDICINE PROGRAM
AT THE UNIVERSITY OF
NEBRASKA-LINCOLN.
DR. COOPER OWENS IS ALSO THE
DIRECTOR OF THE PROGRAM IN
AFRICAN-AMERICAN HISTORY AT THE
LIBRARY COMPANY OF PHILADELPHIA,
COUNTRY'S OLDEST CULTURAL
INSTITUTION.
DR. COOPER OWENS IS AN
ORGANIZATION OF AMERICAN
HISTORIAN DISTINGUISHED LECTURER
PAST AMERICAN COLLEGE OF
OBSTETRICIANS AND GYNECOLOGISTS
FELLOW, RESEARCH FELLOW, AND
SHE'S WON SEVERAL PRESTIGIOUS
HONORS AND AWARDS WITH HER
SCHOLARLY AND ADVOCACY WORK IN
REPRODUCTIVE AND BIRTHING
JUSTICE MOST RECENTLY UNIVERSITY
OF VIRGINIA NURSING HISTORY
INQUIRY SELECTED DR. COOPER
OWENS AS 2022 AGNES DYLAN
RANDOLPH AWARD WINNER FOR
SCHOLARSHIP THAT CENTERS ON
WOMEN HEALERS PUBLIC SPEAKER
SPOKEN WIDELY ACROSS THE UNITED
STATES AND INTERNATIONALLY.
SHE'S PUBLISHED ARTICLES,EST,
SAY,S BOOK CHAPTERS AND MANY
THINK PIECES ON ISSUES THAT
CONCERN AFRICAN-AMERICAN
EXPERIENCES AND REPRODUCTIVE
JUSTICE, HER FIRST BOOK ENTITLED
MEDICAL BONDAGE RACE GENDER AND
THE ORIGINS OF AMERICAN
GYNECOLOGY WON A DARLENE CLARK
HIN E-BOOK AWARD FOR THE
ORGANIZATION OF THE HISTORIANS
BEST BOOK WRITTEN IN AFRICAN
AMERICAN WOMEN'S IN GENDER
HISTORY.
TRANSLATED INTO KOREAN.
NEXT BOOK ENTITLED RESHAPING
FREEDOM HOW HARRIET TUB MAN
RESHAPED HISTORY IT EXAMINES THE
FREEDOM FIGHTERS LIFE POLITICAL
WORK AS A DISABLED PERSON.
AS HER WEBSITE EXPLAINS,
DR. COOPER OWENS KNOWS THAT
STAYING IMMERSED IN THE WORLDS
THAT CULTIVATED HER GROWING
INTEREST IN HISTORY IS WHAT
KEEPS HER GROUNDED AND COMMITTED
TO TEACHING AND SPEAKING ABOUT
COMMUNITY BASE HISTORY.
FROM SITTING ON THE FRONT PORCH
WITH HER LATE GRANDFATHER IN
SOUTH CAROLINA WHILE HE
RE-GAILED HER WITH GHOST STORIES
ABOUT ENSLAVED AND LISTENING TO
BLACK MEN AND WOMEN PLAYING WITH
EACH OTHER IN HER HOMETOWN JUST
SOUTH OF US FROM BETHESDA IN
WASHINGTON D.C. DR. COOPER OWENS
LEARNED THAT STORIES ARE WHAT
DRAW PEOPLE INTO WANTING TO KNOW
ABOUT THE PAST.
IN THIS VERY REGARD I'M THRILLED
TO WELCOME DR. COOPER OWENS TO
THE NATIONAL LIBRARY OF MEDICINE
TODAY TO SPEAK ON WHAT HISTORY
REVEALS.
SLAVERY AND THE DEVELOPMENT OF
U.S. GYNECOLOGY DR. COOPER
OWENS, WELCOME AND THANKS FOR
JOINING US TODAY OVER TO YOU.
>> THANKS SO MUCH, JEFFREY.
I AM SO PLEASED TO SHARE SPACE
WITH ALL OF YOU EVEN THOUGH IT'S
VIRTUAL.
I ACTUALLY DID DISSERTATION
RESEARCH AT THE NATIONAL LIBRARY
OF MEDICINE A LOT OF YEARS AGO.
SO I'M SORRY THAT I'M UNUNABLE
TO BE WITH ALL OF YOU ALL BUT
THANK YOU FOR THE VIRTUAL
AUDIENCE FOR TAKING TIME OUT OF
YOUR DAY.
I'M ACTUALLY BRINGING GREETINGS
FROM BUFFALO NEW YORK WHERE I'M
HOPING TO GIVE A KEYNOTE AT THE
SCHOOL OF MEDICINE 30 MINUTES
AFTER THIS TALK ENDS.
SO I SHOULD GET GOOD PRACTICE.
I'M GOING TO BEGIN.
WHAT HISTORY REVEALS SLAVERY AND
THE DEVELOPMENT OF U.S.
GYNECOLOGY, I REMEMBER AS A GRAD
STUDENT PEOPLE WERE SAYING WHY
AREN'T YOU STUDYING THE CIVIL
WAR?
DO YOU THINK YOU'LL HAVE ENOUGH
INFORMATION TO PUBLISH A
PAMPHLET?
AND I DON'T THINK THAT THEY
MEANT, MAYBE THE PAMPHLET
COMMENT WAS ONE OF ILL INTENT
BUT MOST FOLKS THEY JUST DIDN'T
THINK THERE WERE ENOUGH WRITTEN
SOURCES.
AND SO WHAT I NEEDED TO DO WAS
READ THE SOURCES IN A DIFFERENT
WAY.
AND BY THAT I MEAN HOW DO I READ
SOURCES THAT CENTER THE PATIENTS
AND IN THIS CASE ENSLAVED WOMEN.
I ALSO HAVE A CHAPTER ON IRISH
IMMIGRANT WOMEN IN THE BOOK BUT
ONCE I WAS ABLE TO KIND OF TWEAK
THE WAY THAT I WOULD GAIN
INFORMATION EXTRACT INFORMATION
FROM THOSE ARCHIVAL SOURCES IT
ALLOWED ME A FRAMEWORK FOR BEING
ABLE TO REINTERPRET SOME OF
THOSE SOURCES.
SO WE'LL BEGIN.
WHEN I FIRST STARTED TALKING
ABOUT SLAVERY AND GYNECOLOGY
INEVITABLY PEOPLE WOULD ASK ME
ABOUT HEALTH DISPARITIES, AND
BECAUSE I'M A HISTORIAN OF THE
19th CENTURY IN THE UNITED
STATES, I WOULD OFTEN GET, WELL,
THAT'S THEN.
RIGHT?
YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE WHO
ARE DEAD.
AND I'M, LIKE, I AM, BUT LET ME
SHOW YOU A CONNECTION SO THAT WE
CAN PUT THE PAST IN CONVERSATION
WITH THE PRESENT.
SO, SOME OF YOU HAVE PROBABLY
HEARD OF DR. SAMUEL CARTWRIGHT.
HE WAS CONSIDERED KIND OF
INFAMOUS DURING HIS DAYS OF
PUBLISHING ARTICLE IN THE 1830S
ABOUT THE DISTINCTIVENESS OF
NEGRO DISEASES.
AND LEST WE THINK CARTWRIGHT WAS
SITTING AROUND TWIDDLING HIS
THUMBS IN WANTING TO DO THIS, HE
WAS ASKED TO CONDUCT RESEARCH
AND TO PUBLISH THIS ARTICLE BY
THE LOUISIANA STATE MEDICAL
ASSOCIATION.
AND SO HE DOES SO.
AND WHAT HE FINDS IS QUITE
INTERESTING.
HE SAYS THAT IN FACT THE NEGRO
DOES HAVE DISTINCTIVE DISEASES
THAT WHITE PEOPLE DON'T
EXPERIENCE.
AND SO HE TALKED ABOUT
RASCALITY, THEY ACTED UP, THAT
WAS A NEGRO DISEASE.
THERE WERE DISEASES THAT
ENCOMPASSED ENSLAVED PEOPLE, AND
HIS SAMPLE POPULATION THAT HE
STUDIED WERE ALL ENSLAVED.
THEY WOULD EAT CLAY OR DIRT.
THAT WAS A DISTINCTIVE NEGRO
DISEASE AND THE MOST, I THINK,
THE MOST FAMOUS THAT STILL
LINGERS TODAY IS BASED ON HIS
RESEARCH AND FINDINGS THAT THE
NEGRO SUFFERS FROM DRATS ANEMIA
IT WAS A MEDICAL CONDITION THAT
WAS A MENTAL ILLNESS IF A
ENSLAVED PERSON RAN AWAY OR
HARBORED THOUGHTS OF RUNNING
AWAY THEY SUFFERED FROM THIS.
AND SO CARTWRIGHT CONTINUES THIS
KIND OF BINARY WAY OF LOOKING AT
BLACK PEOPLE AND WHITE PEOPLE IN
AMERICA, AND IT HAS A LASTING
INFLUENCE AND IMPACT.
AND IN THE 1850S, I'M JUST GOING
TO POINT HERE ON MY SCREEN SO
IT'S TOWARDS MY RIGHT.
YOU'LL SEE A COVER OF A BOOK BY
A WONDERFUL MEDICAL
ANTHROPOLOGIST AT BROWN
UNIVERSITY FOR QUITE SOME TIME
VAUGHN AND SHE WROTE ABOUT THE
SPROMTER IT'S ON THE FRONT OF
THE BOOK.
BREATHING RACE INTO THE MACHINE.
IF YOU HAVEN'T READ IT, IT'S A
WONDERFUL BOOK.
THIS BAROMETER AND THEY HAVE A
RELATIONSHIP.
HE USES IT TO ASSESS LUNG
CAPACITY.
BECAUSE HE HAS AN INKLING THAT
PERHAPS A NEGRO HAS A DIMINISHED
LUNG CAPACITY.
AND GUESS WHAT HE HAS THESE
ENSLAVED NEGROS BREATHE INTO THE
MACHINE AND IN FACT COMPARED TO
WHITE PEOPLE THE NEGRO HAS A
LESSENED LUNG CAPACITY.
HE'S NOT THE FIRST TO CONDUCT
THIS KIND OF RESEARCH.
THOMAS JEFFERSON WROTE ABOUT IT
IN HIS 1803 BOOK, AND BENJAMIN
RUSH WROTE ABOUT IT PRESENTED
HIS WORK IN 1799 AT THE AMERICAN
PHILOSOPHICAL SOCIETY.
SO THIS WASN'T NEW.
BUT CARTWRIGHT IS ACTUALLY USING
A NEW TOOL.
A NEWLY DEVELOPED TOOL SPROMETER
THE IMPACT OF THAT STUDY BETWEEN
BLACK AND WHITE PEOPLE HAS
TENTACLES THAT REACH INTO THE
CIVIL WAR.
THE U.S. COMMISSION OF THE
UNITED STATES ARMY, THE NORTH,
THEY THEN BEGIN THESE RACE-BASED
STUDIES TO SEE IF BLACK PEOPLE
AND WHITE PEOPLE ARE DIFFERENT.
AND POLITICALLY ALL OF THIS IS
GOING ON ALL THE WAY FROM
CARTWRIGHT'S ARTICLE IN THE
1830S UNTIL THE NEWER RESEARCH
THAT EMERGED IN THE 1850S AND
1860S, REALLY PEOPLE ARE TRYING
TO FIGURE OUT ARE BLACK PEOPLE
FIT FOR FREEDOM OR ENSLAVERY.
AND THEY HAD FANTASTICAL IDEAS
ABOUT NEGRO DIFFERENCE OR THESE
ALLEGED BIOLOGICAL DIFFERENCES
THAT IMPACTED THAT.
IT CONTINUES TO THE 21st
CENTURY.
THEY SAY THAT WAS THEN, WHAT'S
ABOUT NOW?
UNFORTUNATELY, THERE'S STILL
EXAMPLES THAT WE CAN PULL FROM
IN THE 21st CENTURY.
KELLY HAWKINS IS PICTURED HERE
IN 2014 WAS A PH.D. CANDIDATE
SHE AND HER RESEARCH TEAM
DECIDED THAT THEY WANTED TO
CONDUCT THIS STUDY AROUND
BELIEFS OF BIOLOGICAL
DIFFERENCES BETWEEN BLACKS AND
WHITES.
AND THEY DID SO WITH THE
UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA.
AND SO IN HER STUDY, THERE WERE
ALMOST 300 FOLKS SAMPLED, 263.
I'LL GIVE YOU THIS, I START OFF
WITH A LOW NUMBER IN TERMS OF
THE STATISTICS, BUT THE END IS A
REALLY HIGH NUMBER.
AND MANY OF THE BELIEFS ARE THE
SAME.
AND SO HER RESEARCH REVEALED AND
THE ARTICLE WAS PUBLISHED TWO
YEARS LATER YOU CAN GOOGLE IT'S
PRETTY WELL KNOWN, BUT THE
RESEARCH FOUND THAT THE BELIEFS
PREDICTED RACIAL BIAS AND
TREATMENT AND RECOMMENDATION
ACCURACY, PROVIDED THE FIRST
EVIDENCE THAT THERE'S BIAS IN
PAIN PRODUCTION ASSOCIATED WITH
RACIAL BIAS AND PAIN TREATMENT
RECOMMENDATIONS AND JUST TO GIVE
YOU A SENSE OF SOME OF THE
CONDITIONS THAT SHE AND HER TEAM
GAVE TO THESE MEDICAL RESIDENTS
AND FACULTY MEMBERS AT THE
UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA MEDICAL
SCHOOL WAS CHILDBIRTH, WHETHER
ONE SUFFERS FROM KIDNEY STONES
AND PAINFUL CONDITIONS.
BUT TAKEN TOGETHER HER WORK
PROVIDED EVIDENCE THAT FALSE
BELIEFS ABOUT BIOLOGICAL
DIFFERENCES BETWEEN BLACKS AND
WHITES CONTINUE TO SHAPE THE WAY
WE RECEIVE AND TREAT BLACK
PEOPLE.
YOU SHOULD SEE SOME OF THE
QUESTIONS.
TWO OF THE FOLKS WHO WERE
SURVEYED BELIEVED BLACK PEOPLE
WERE BORN WITH TAILS.
THEY BELIEVED BLACK PEOPLE HAD
THICKER SKIN, AGED FASTER, THAT
BLACK PEOPLE AND WHITE PEOPLE
WERE BIOLOGICALLY DIFFERENT.
I MEAN, THERE WERE THESE IDEAS
THAT PERSISTED BUT WERE SIMILAR
TO THE IDEAS THAT DR. SAMUEL
CARTWRIGHT WROTE ABOUT IN THE
ANTE BELLUM ERA.
FOR ME AS A PROFESSOR AND
SOMEONE WHO TAUGHT IN SOCIAL
SCIENCES BUT IN GENETICS,
TEACHING STUDENTS FOR DECADES
THAT RACE IS NOT A BIOLOGICAL
CONSTRUCT, BUT IN FACT A
SOCIOLOGICAL CONSTRUCT.
AND I HAVE TO ADD AS SOMEONE WHO
WAS A POST-DOC AT UVA, I KNOW,
UVA IS A PRETTY RIGOROUS SCHOOL.
SO IF YOU'RE ENTERING INTO MED
SCHOOL THAT MEANS YOU'RE TOP OF
THE TOP, RIGHT?
AT LEAST IN TERMS OF THE
ASSESSMENTS THAT PEOPLE HAVE AND
USE.
AND SO THESE ARE PEOPLE COMING
IN WITH FOUR-YEAR UNIVERSITY
DEGREES.
AND INSTEAD OF CHOOSING TO
BELIEVE IN THE SCIENCE, THEY ARE
BELIEVING IN THESE ANTI BLACK
BELIEFS, THAT SAY THAT THERE IS
SOME TO SPEAK OF BETWEEN BLACK
AND WHITE.
SO WHERE DOES ALL THIS COME TO?
WELL, FOR ME IT DOESN'T START
WITH JAMES MADISON A LOT OF
PEOPLE BELIEVES IT DOES.
BUT HOPEFULLY IF YOU READ THE
BOOK YOU'LL SEE THAT I'M
ACTUALLY CREATING A NARRATIVE
THAT EXTENDS FAR BEYOND SIMMS
BUT ALSO BEFORE SIMMS EMERGES AS
A FIGURE IN THE HISTORY OF
GYNECOLOGY.
AND SO I WAS REALLY BROUGHT INTO
THIS CONVERSATION AROUND THE
CONSCIOUS PATIENT OF JAMES
LEGACY A FEW MONTHS BEFORE MY
BOOK WAS TO BE PUBLISHED.
I LIVED IN NEW YORK AT THE TIME
AND I WAS WORKING AT KINGS
COLLEGE AND I CAN REMEMBER
GETTING A NUMBER OF DMs AND
TEXTS AND THINGS ON FACEBOOK AND
PEOPLE ARE LIKE, WHY DIDN'T YOU
TELL ME YOU WERE ORGANIZING A
PROTEST AT THE SIMMS STATUE.
HIS STATUE AS YOU CAN SEE ON THE
SLIDE WAS AT THE EASTERNMOST
POINT IN CENTRAL PARK RIGHT
ACROSS THE ACADEMY OF MEDICINE.
I'M ALMOST 50 I'M NEVER THAT
EXCITED I HAVE TO SEE WHAT'S
GOING ON.
AND I SEE THIS PICTURE THAT HAS
BECOME VIRAL.
FOUR BLACK WOMEN POSED IN FRONT
OF SIMMS OR SIMMS' LIKENESS.
AND THEY HAVE DONNED HOSPITAL
GOWNS SPATTERED IN PAINT LOOKING
LIKE BLOOD AND THE PICTURE WENT
EVERYWHERE IT WAS VIRAL GLOBALLY
AROUND SIMMS' EXPERIMENTAL
TREATMENT OF ENSLAVED WOMEN IN
ALABAMA NOW KNOWN AS THE MOTHERS
OF GYNECOLOGY.
AND SO I DIDN'T KNOW ANYTHING
ABOUT IT.
THEY WERE MEMBERS OF THE BLACK
YOUTH PROJECT.
100, CUT OFF 30 YEARS OLD.
THAT SHIP SAILED MANY MOONS AGO
BUT WHAT IT DID IT BROUGHT ME TO
THE ATTENTION OF JOURNALISTS AND
ACTIVISTS AND PEOPLE WHO WANTED
TO KNOW WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS
ON THE REMOVAL OF THE STATUE OR
DO I BELIEVE THE STATUE TO STAY
AND BE HISTORICALLY
CONTEXTUALIZED.
I DIDN'T WANT TO PLAY NICE.
I WAS A JOURNALISM MAJOR IN
COLLEGE UNDERGRAD I KNEW ONCE I
GAVE MY ANSWER THEY'D MOVE ON TO
THE NEXT STORY.
SO I DIDN'T.
I KNEW THIS WAS AN OPPORTUNITY
FOR ME AS A HISTORIAN OF SLAVERY
OF MEDICINE OF 19TH CENTURY U.S.
HISTORY, HOW CAN I CREATE AN
UNDERSTANDING OF THE ANTEBELLUM
WORLD WHO MIGHT NOT HAVE AN
OPTION OF KNOWING THE
LITERATURE, BEING COLLEGE
STUDENTS ALL OF THOSE KINDS OF
THINGS.
AND SO I DIDN'T ANSWER THOSE
QUESTIONS.
WHAT I TRIED TO DO TO THE BEST
OF MY ABILITY WAS TO REALLY
TACKLE THIS BINARY FRAMING OF
SIMMS EITHER A SAINT OR THOSE
WHO DEFENDED HIM OR A BRUTAL
MONSTER.
AND THIS IS EXHIBITED IN
INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALISM PIECE
PUBLISHED BY SOUTH CAROLINA
APOST COURIER.
BUT THERE'S SOMETHING ABOUT THE
STORY FRAMING THAT RUBBED ME THE
WRONG WAY BECAUSE THINGS ARE A
LOT MORE NUANCED AND
COMPLICATED.
SO THE SAVIOR OF WOMEN WERE
MEDICAL MONSTERS, SOUTH
CAROLINA'S MOST INFAMOUS
PHYSICIAN AND LAWRENCE COMES UP
WITH THIS TITLE LARGELY BECAUSE
MANY OF THOSE WHO WERE CRITIQUED
HIM, THEY CRITIQUED HIM BECAUSE
HE DIDN'T ASK FOR INFORMED
CONSENT FROM HIS ENSLAVED
PATIENTS.
SIMMS GAVE THEM OPIATES FOR POST
SURGERY THAT SIMMS MADE THEM
WORK WHILE THEY WERE HIS
PATIENTS.
AND ALSO THAT SIMMS CREATED THE
IDEA THAT BLACK PEOPLE DIDN'T
EXPERIENCE PAIN.
AND ALSO SIMMS DIDN'T GIVE THEM
ANESTHESIA.
HERE I AM, YOU CAN LOOK AT ME
I'M VISIBLY BLACK AND SO HERE I
AM A HISTORIAN OF MEDICINE AND
ENSLAVERY AND HAVING TO TELL
PEOPLE ESPECIALLY FOLKS WHO LOOK
LIKE ME LET ME CORRECT YOU ON
SOME OF THESE.
I WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN ABLE TO GET
A BOOK PUBLISHED IF I CENTERED
MY ARGUMENT AROUND SIMMS NOT
ASKING FOR INFORMED CONSENT.
AND I HAVE TO EXPLAIN IT.
IF YOU WERE ENSLAVED, THE LEGAL
DEFINITION FOR ENSLAVED PERSON
IS NOT THAT THEY WERE HUMAN
BEINGS BUT THAT THEY WERE
MOVABLE PROPERTY OR CHATTEL.
AND SO SLAVE OWNERS HAD NO LEGAL
OBLIGATION TO ASK AN ENSLAVED
PERSON WHETHER THEY WOULD
CONSENT TO SURGERY OR MEDICAL
TREATMENT.
THE CONSENT HAD TO COME FROM THE
OWNER.
I'M WRITING ABOUT THE LATE 18th
CENTURY, 19TH CENTURY.
AND SO WHETHER AN ENSLAVED
PERSON SAID NO, I DON'T WANT TO
GO, THEY DON'T OWN THEIR BODIES,
UNFORTUNATELY.
THAT WAS THE LAW OF THE LAND.
AND SIMMS WAS WORKING WITHIN
THAT LEGAL LANDSCAPE.
THE OTHER THING, ANESTHESIA HAD
BEEN DISCOVERED.
ANESTHESIA HAD BEEN DISCOVERED
BUT NOT WIDELY USED IN THE 1840S
THIS WAS IN THE EARLY 1840S BUT
THE MEDICAL BRANCH
ANESTHESIOLOGY HAD NOT BEEN
ESTABLISHED YET.
AND SO MOST PHYSICIANS AND
SURGEONS WERE NOT GOING TO USE
ANESTHESIA.
IN FACT, WE KNOW MANY OF THE TWO
STORIES ABOUT HOW ANESTHESIA WAS
FOUNDED BY DENTISTS THEY IN FACT
EXPERIMENTED ON THEMSELVES.
SO MOST DOCTORS WOULD NOT HAVE
USED ANESTHESIA BECAUSE THE
PERSON THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT
DOSAGE TO GIVE THAT PERSON.
RIGHT?
THE PERSON COULD POSSIBLY BLEED
OUT WHILE THEY'RE IN TWILIGHT.
SO SIMMS ONCE AGAIN DOING WHAT
ANYONE ELSE WOULD HAVE DONE
DURING THAT TIME PERIOD,
ESPECIALLY BEFORE THE
ESTABLISHMENT OF ANESTHESIOLOGY,
THE MEDICAL BRANCH.
WHAT ABOUT SIMMS MAKING THESE
ENSLAVED WOMEN WORK WHILE THEY
WERE HIS PATIENTS I'LL GET INTO
THAT MORE PROVIDING DETAILS, BUT
I'M SAYING PEOPLE DO KNOW THAT
SLAVERY WAS A ECONOMIC LABOR
INSTITUTION.
SLAVERY WAS BASED ON THIS.
AND A SLAVE OWNER SIMMS WAS A
SLAVE OWNER, THEY DIDN'T CARE IF
YOU WERE SICK OR NOT.
YOU STILL HAD TO WORK.
THAT'S WHAT ENSLAVED PERSON WERE
DOING IT WAS A SYSTEM BUILT UP
THE WEALTH OF A NATION.
SO THERE WAS NO OTHER
ALTERNATIVE, UNFORTUNATELY,
BECAUSE THESE WOMEN WERE
ENSLAVED.
WELL, HE GAVE THEM OPIATES AND
SO DID EVERY AMERICAN PHYSICIAN
SURGEON AT THAT TIME.
OPIATES WERE IN EVERYTHING, JUST
LIKE MERCURY.
SO IT WASN'T TO CREATE AN
ADDICTION, IT WAS TO CREATE A
STOPPAGE.
I'LL GO INTO THE SURGERY THAT HE
PERFORMS, BUT INCONTINENCE WAS A
RESULT OF THE CONDITIONS WOMEN
SUFFERED FROM DUE TO CHILDBIRTH.
AND SO IF YOU ARE TRYING TO
SUTURE UP OR STITCH A PATIENT TO
GIVE TO PROVIDE THEM WITH AN
OPIATE MEANS THEY'RE NOT GOING
TO HAVE A BOWEL MOVEMENT AND
BREAK THOSE SUTURES AND THE
OTHER SIDE HE SAVED THESE WOMEN
HE TOOK THEM IN AT COST HE
REALLY CARED ABOUT THEM.
NO HE DIDN'T.
SIMMS WANTED TO SECURE THE VALUE
OF THESE ENSLAVED WOMEN BECAUSE
THE ENGINE OF SLAVERY WAS
DEPENDENT UPON THE ENSLAVED
WOMEN'S ABILITY TO LIVE THROUGH
PREGNANCY AND BIRTH HEALTHY
CHILDREN BECAUSE THE STATUS OF
SLAVERY WAS PASSED FROM THE
MOTHER TO THE CHILD.
THAT WAS THE LAW OF THE LAND
SINCE THE COLONIAL PERIOD.
I MEAN SINCE THE 1600S.
JUST TO LET YOU KNOW HOW LONG
THAT LAW HAD STOOD IN THE UNITED
STATES, AND SO I WANTED TO BE
ABLE TO RESHAPE THE CONVERSATION
BEYOND THE EITHER/OR BUT TO
REALLY SAY WHAT WERE SOME OF THE
BIOMEDICAL ETHICAL CONCERNS OF
THE 19TH CENTURY THAT WE CAN
GRAPPLE WITH?
SIMMS KNEW HE WAS BREAKING THE
LAW.
AND SO WE'LL TALK ABOUT THAT IN
JUST A MINUTE.
SO I STARTED WITH THIS CRITICAL
QUESTION.
ESPECIALLY WHEN TALKING TO
GROUPS AND JOURNALISTS WAS
EXCEPTIONAL IN HIS TREATMENT OF
ENSLAVED WOMEN AND I SAY NO HE
WASN'T.
SIMMS WAS GOOD AT BRANDING
HIMSELF, IF I COULD USE 21st
CENTURY LANGUAGE.
AND HE WAS A PRETTY PROLIFIC
AUTHOR AND WRITER BUT HE WASN'T
THAT EXCEPTIONAL FOR THE THINGS
THAT PEOPLE WERE ACCUSING HIM
OF.
AND FOR ME A PART OF ANSWERING
THIS QUESTION IS TO MOVE US FROM
HISTORICAL BOOGIEMEN BECAUSE
THEN YOU CAN DUMP EVERYTHING ON
ONE PERSON AND IT ABSOLVES THE
FIELD AND I'M SEEING THINGS ARE
MUCH MORE COMPLICATED THAN ONE
PERSON.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SOMETHING
THAT WAS STRUCTURAL AND
SYSTEMIC.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT STRUCTURE
AND SYSTEMS OF OPPRESSION, THEN
AS A HISTORIAN I HAVE TO GIVE
YOU AN INTELLECTUAL GENEALOGY
ABOUT THOSE WHO CAME FORTH.
IN MY BOOK I STARTED WITH
GEORGE, ARGUABLY THE WESTERN
WORLD'S MOST FAMOUS HISTORIAN
SCIENTIST BASED IN FRANCE AND HE
BECOMES AN INTERESTING FIGURE
FOR ME BECAUSE OF HIS TREATMENT
OF A SOUTH AFRICAN BORN WOMAN
NAMED SATA TORATAN.
SOME OF YOU MAY BE MORE FAMILIAR
WITH THE HORRIBLE NAME SHE WAS
GIVEN.
BUT HE DISSECTED HER CADAVER.
AND HE DISSECTED HER CADAVER
BECAUSE HE WAS INTERESTED IN
WHETHER SATTA BARTON WAS A MIX
BETWEEN HUMAN AND PRIMATES DID
SHE HAVE AN ELONGATED -- WHAT IN
THE WORLD WAS THIS WOMAN?
AND GUESS WHAT HE PERFORMS THE
AUTOPSY.
AND FINDS OUT SHE'S JUST LIKE A
REGULAR HUMAN BEING.
BUT WHY WAS HE SO INTENT ON
MAKING HER DIFFERENT THAN OTHER
HUMAN BEINGS AND WHITE PEOPLE?
BECAUSE OF THE SIZE OF HER
BUTTOCKS.
SHE ESSENTIALLY HAD A BIG BUTT.
AND IT WASN'T SEEN AS JUST A
WOMAN WITH A LARGE DARIER IT'S
BEEN DEFINED MEDICALLY.
GEOPESIA.
WHEN HE PERFORMS THIS AUTOPSY ON
HER WITNESSES THE GENITALIA,
PUTS IT IN A BELL JAR AND CLEANS
THE SKELETON, RESEMBLES IT AND
DISPLAYS IT AND IN FACT SHE DIED
IN THE EARLY 19TH CENTURY.
HER REMAINS WERE ON DISPLAY IN
THE NATIONAL MUSEUM IN PARIS
UNTIL 1974 WHEN HER GENITALIA,
IT WASN'T UNTIL THE 21st CENTURY
THAT THE MUSEUM SENT HER REMAINS
BACK TO SOUTH AFRICA SO THAT SHE
COULD HAVE A PROPER BURIAL.
HE WAS DOING THIS IN THE LATE
18th AND EARLY 19th CENTURY.
AND THEN THIS WAS A SLAVE OWNER
PERFORMS THE COUNTRY'S FIRST
ABDOMINAL BASED SURGERY ON A
WHITE WOMAN.
SHE SURVIVED AND SO MCDOWELL
SAYS OH, MY GOSH, I HAVE TO BE
ABLE TO PERFECT MY TECHNIQUE ON
THE REMOVAL OF THESE OVARIAN
TUMORS.
AND SO HE GATHERS UP CASES ABOUT
FIVE, FOUR OR FIVE NEGRESSES AS
THEY WERE CALLED AND OUT OF THE
BLACK WOMEN ALL WERE ENSLAVED
EXCEPT FOR ONE.
OVER THE PERIOD OF ALMOST A
DECADE HAPPENED IN 1809 THE
SURGERY ON THE WHITE WOMAN.
SO FROM 1809 UNTIL 1817 HE'S
PERFORMING THESE EXPERIMENTAL
SURGERIES TO REMOVE OVARIAN
TUMORS.
AND FOR ME IT WAS SO INTERESTING
BECAUSE THIS IS APPALACHIA.
AND APPALACHIA NEVER HAD A HUGE
BLACK POPULATION WHEN MCDOWELL
WAS PERFORMING THESE SURGERIES,
AFRICAN-AMERICANS CONSTITUTE
ONLY 4% OF THE POPULATION.
IN DANBURY.
AND SO I'M THINKING HOW IN THE
WORLD HOW IS HE FINDING THESE
BLACK WOMEN WITH OVARIAN TUMORS
BUT FIND THEM HE DOES HE
PUBLISHES AN ARTICLE IN 1817 AND
LAYS OUT EVERYTHING THAT HE DID.
TALKS ABOUT THE ONE WOMAN SIDE
DURING THE EXPERIMENTAL TRIAL.
HE TALKS ABOUT THE WHITE PATIENT
WHO LIVES AND ONE WOULD THINK
UH-HO, THIS IS GOING TO PUT
AMERICA ON THE GLOBAL MAP
MEDICALLY.
IT DOES NOT, IN FACT IN THE
LANCIT STILL IN EXISTENCE TODAY
AS SOME OF YOU KNOW A
DR. JOHNSON FROM BRITAIN AND HE
SAID THE IMPUNITY OF DOGS AND
RABBITS ANIMALS PRO CREATE
FASTER, THE IDEA OF BLACKS NOT
EXPERIENCING PAIN.
AND ANOTHER IS KNOWN AS THE
FATHER OF PLASTIC SURGERY BUT
HE'S IMPORTANT IN TERMS OF THE
DEVELOPMENT OF GYNECOLOGY
BECAUSE OF THE WORK THAT HE DOES
WITH VESICLE VAGINAL FISTULA.
THAT'S WHAT THE VVF MEANS.
IT'S THE SAME SURGERY THAT PUT
SIMMS ON THE MAP.
JOHN PETER MCDOWELL SLAVE OWNER,
A BUILDER FOUNDED THE RANDOLPH
McKEEN COLLEGE OF MEDICINE NO
LONGER IN EXISTENCE BUT HE'S
EXPERIMENTING ON ENSLAVED WOMAN
AND WHITE WOMAN.
AND BOTH SUFFERING FROM THE
VESICLE VAGINAL FISTULA.
AFTER PROLONGED CHILDBIRTH
SESSION TEARING HAPPENS AS
YOU'RE TRYING TO PUSH OUT THE
FETUS AND THE FETUS JUST ISN'T
MOVING.
SO TEARING HAPPENS IN THE
VAGINAL AREA AND IF IT'S REALLY
SEVERE IN THE ANAL AREA AS WELL.
AND SO THE FISTULA OR HOLE IS
FORMED AND BECAUSE THE VESICLE
THE BLADDER IS RIGHT AT THE
UPPER VAGINAL AREA YOU HAVE
INCONTINENCE AND AS I SAID
TEARING IN THE BACK INCONTINENCE
HERE AS WELL.
SO ONE MUST REALIZE THIS IS NOT
A GOOD THING IF YOU ARE A SLAVE
OWNER, IF YOU'RE AN ENSLAVED
WOMEN, IT DECREASES YOUR VALUE.
AND SO IN 1807, THE U.S.
CONSTITUTION BANS THE ATLANTIC
SLAVE TRADE.
SO LEGALLY YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSED
TO HAVE SHIPS THAT COME IN FROM
AFRICA OR THE CARIBBEAN TO THE
UNITED STATES.
SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS IN 1808
THERE'S A REALLY CONCERTED
EFFORT TO EITHER ROUTINE OR
MAINTAIN OR CREATE IN SOME
INSTANCES GOOD REPRODUCTIVE
HEALTH FOR ENSLAVED WOMEN
BECAUSE AS I MENTIONED BEFORE
THE COLONIAL LEGISLATORS BACK IN
THE 1600S SAW HOW LUCRATIVE
SLAVERY WAS AND SO THEY LEANED
ON THIS ANCIENT LAW WHICH MEANT
THAT THE CONDITION OF THE WOMB
IS TRANSFERRED TO THE CHILD.
EVERYTHING BEFORE THEN THE
CHILDREN INHERITED THE STATUS OF
THE FATHER.
BUT NOT IN THE CASE OF SLAVERY
IN THIS COUNTRY.
AND SO YOU CANNOT HAVE A PERSON
WHO WAS LITERALLY PRODUCING A
NEW SLAVE LABOR FORCE.
YOU CAN'T HAVE HER UNHEALTHY IN
TERMS OF REPRODUCTIVE HEALTH.
AND SO DR. MATIRE, HE PROVIDES A
SUTURE METHOD TO SUTURE THE
WHITE PEOPLE AND ENSLAVED WOMAN
AND THE WHITE WOMAN IS HEALED.
RATHER QUICKLY.
ENSLAVED WOMAN IS NOT.
AND HE WRITES, CONTINUES THE
EXPERIMENTATION AND THE PATIENT
DOESN'T HEAL AND HE WRITES IN A
MOMENT OF FRUSTRATION IN HIS
ARTICLE, IT'S NONE OF THAT KIND
OF 19-CENTURY FLOWERY LANGUAGE
THEY'RE USING EUPHEMISMS.
HE'S SAYING IF THE PATIENT HAD
STOPPED ENGAGING IN SEXUAL
INTERCOURSE SHE COULD HAVE BEEN
HEALED AS IF IT WAS THE ENSLAVED
WOMAN'S FAULT.
SO ALSO THIS IDEA OF PATIENT,
THOUGHTS OF A MEDICAL OUTCOME.
I'M SOMEONE LIVING IN THE 21st
CENTURY.
AND I'M THINKING, WELL, PERHAPS
SLAVERY WAS WE WOULD SAY THE
NEGATIVE SOCIAL DETERMINANT,
THAT IN FACT AN ENSLAVED WOMAN
COULD NOT STOP ENGAGING IN SEX
AND AS WE KNOW SEXUAL ABUSE WAS
A NORMAL PART OF GIRLS AND
WOMEN'S LIVES WHO WERE ENSLAVED.
AND THEN LASTLY THE FATHER OF
THE C SECTION, A LOT OF FOLKS
HAVEN'T HEARD OF HIM.
BUT HE'S FRENCH BORN GRADUATES
WITH A MEDICAL DEGREE.
MOVES TO THE MOST PROFITABLE
COLONY IN 1899, BEGINS TO
PERFECT THE CESAREAN SECTION.
AND HE GETS WIND THERE'S
REVOLUTION IN THE AIR AND LEAVES
HAITI IMGRATES TO DONALDSONVILLE
LOUISIANA NOT TOO FAR FROM BATON
ROUGE AND HE PERFORMS TWO
SUCCESSFUL CESAREANS HE'S KNOWN
AS THE SECOND AMERICAN TO HAVE
SUCCESSFUL CESAREAN SECTIONS.
THE REALLY INTERESTING THING,
HISTORY IS NOT ALWAYS LINGERING.
I KNOW MANY OF YOU HISTORIANS
YOU KNOW THAT.
SOMETIMES IT'S CIRCULAR.
I MEAN IT'S CIRCUITOUS, ALL
THESE THINGS.
BUT IN THE CASE WHAT HE LEAVES
IN TERMS OF THE MEDICAL LEGACY,
THE STATE OF LOUISIANA, SINCE
THE 19TH CENTURY, REMEMBER WE'RE
IN THE 21st CENTURY, HAD BEEN
THE STATE THAT HAD THE HIGHEST
RATES OF BLACK WOMEN
EXPERIENCING C-SECTIONS.
IT WAS A DISPROPORTIONATE USAGE
OF BLACK WOMEN FROM SLAVERY
UNTIL FREEDOM IN LOUISIANA.
IT WAS ONLY RECENTLY THAT
LOUISIANA WAS KNOCKED FROM
NUMBER ONE TO NUMBER TWO,
MISSISSIPPI DISPLACED LOUISIANA
AS THE STATE THAT USES BLACK
WOMEN TO IN C-SECTIONS MORE THAN
ANY OTHER STATE.
SO THIS IS THE LONG LASTING
LEGACY.
SO THIS IS MY WAY OF SAYING WE
HAVE TO GET RID OF THIS
EXCEPTIONALITY NARRATIVE THAT
SOMEHOW HE WAS MORE BRUTAL OR --
I'M SAYING THERE WAS BRUTALITY
AND CRUELTY TO GO AROUND,
ESPECIALLY FROM THE PERSPECTIVE
OF THESE ENSLAVED WOMEN WHO HAVE
TO ENDURE NOT JUST THE SURGERIES
BUT BEING TAKEN AWAY FROM THEIR
HOMES, THEIR FAMILIES, THEIR
FRIENDS, THEIR COMMUNITIES,
WHILE THEY UNDERGO EXPERIMENTAL
SURGERIES THAT LAST FOR YEARS.
SO THE NEXT SLIDE AFTER MCDOWELL
KNOWN AS THE FATHER OF THE
BARIOTOMY MOST DON'T TALK ABOUT
HIM MUCH TODAY BUT IN THE LATE
70S OR 80S THERE WAS A PBS
SPECIAL ON HIS LIFE.
AND RANDOLPH THE COLLEGE OF
MEDICINE WHO WAS A PIONEER IN
OBSTETRICAL FISTULA AND PLASTIC
SURGERIES REPAIRED A CLEFT LIP
AND PUBLISHED IN THE SAME
ARTICLES THAT SIMMS PUBLISHED IN
ALMOST A DECADE LATER.
AND JAMES MARION SIMMS KNOWN AS
THE FATHER OF AMERICAN
GYNECOLOGY I OFTEN HAVE TO TELL
PEOPLE HE WAS ONLY KNOWN AS THE
FATHER OF AMERICAN GYNECOLOGY
AFTER HE DIED.
AND SO HE BECOMES REALLY
INTERESTING BECAUSE I THINK
SIMMS THAT DREW TO THIS FIELD.
I HAD ALWAYS BEEN INTERESTED IN
WRITING AND RESEARCHING ENSLAVED
WOMENS LIVES AND STORIES AND
IMPACT.
BUT I REMEMBER READING A BOOK BY
JANETTA COLE.
PRESIDENT OF BENNETT COLLEGE AND
SHUCKEL I WAS GOING TO EMCEE A
SHOW WHERE COLE WAS A GUEST AND
MAYBE TWO OR THREE SENTENCES IN
DR. COLE'S BENEFIT AND
DR. SHUCKEL THERE WAS THIS
PASSAGE THAT TALKED ABOUT A MAN
I NEVER HEARD OF, JAMES MYRON
SIMMS AND EXPERIMENTAL SURGERIES
ON ENSLAVED WOMEN IN ALABAMA AND
IT BLEW MY MIND BECAUSE I HAD
GONE TO BENNETT COLLEGE, HBCU
FOR WOMEN, AFRICAN AMERICAN
STUDIES FOCUS.
HERE I WAS AT UCLA EARNING A
PH.D. IN AMERICAN HISTORY NEVER
HEARD OF HIM BEFORE.
WHEN I STARTED TO DO MY RESEARCH
AND READ BROADLY, I REALIZED
THAT THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT WAS
ONGOING AND STRUCTURAL AND THE
WAYS THAT THESE PIONEERING
PHYSICIANS DEVELOPED OBSTETRICS
AND GYNECOLOGY, THEIR
DEVELOPMENT OF THE FIELD
HAPPENED AS QUICKLY AS IT DID IN
STOUT BECAUSE OF THEIR ACCESS TO
ENSLAVED.
SO I WAS JUST KIND OF LIKE WHOA,
THERE'S A LEAKAGE HERE AND I
NEED TO EXPLORE THIS.
SO JAMES MARION SIMMS WAS NOT
SOMEONE WHO TRANSITIONALLY
EXAMINED WOMEN OR BILLED HIMSELF
AS A PRACTITIONER OF WOMEN'S
HEALTH PROBLEMS.
BUT IN THE 1840S HE WAS
CONFRONTED BY A WHITE WOMAN
FALLEN OFF A HORSE THIS WAS
NARROW.
AND AS HE ASKS PERMISSION TO
EXAMINE HER AS YOU KNOW MALE
PHYSICIANS DON'T TYPICALLY
PERFORM VAGINAL EXAMINATIONS ON
WOMEN, ESPECIALLY WHITE WOMEN
WHO ARE MARRIED.
THIS IS NARROW.
HE DOES SO AND HE WRITES, THIS
IS WHAT HE WRITES IN HIS
AUTOBIOGRAPHY.
HE REMEMBERED SOMETHING FROM MED
SCHOOL, A LECTURE, THAT SAID
THAT INSTRUCT THE MED STUDENTS
IF YOU COULD OPEN UP THE VAGINAL
CAVITY FLAT ENOUGH THE SPEED OR
RUSH OF AIR WILL COME IN TURN
THE UTERUS RIGHT SIDE UP.
AND THIS WAS SOMEONE THAT FELL
OFF A HORSE.
HE CLAIMS IF THE SPEED TURNED IT
RIGHT SIDE UP.
EVERY TIME I TELL THAT TO MED
SCHOOL NURSING FACULTY THEY
LAUGH LOUDLY.
BUT ANYWAY, HE THEN HAS THIS
IDEA, OH, MY GOSH, IF I CAN
EXAMINE THIS ENSLAVED WOMEN WHO
WAS STILL AT HIS HOSPITAL.
HE WAS GOING TO SEND HER ON HER
WAY BACK TO HER OWNER SHE WAS
SUFFERING FROM VESICLE FISTULA.
I MIGHT BE ABLE TO SECURE THIS
DREADFUL CONDITION.
HE TAKES HER EXAMINES HER USING
TUBULAR SPOONS WHICH IT'S THE
PRACTICE THAT WE'RE STILL USING
FROM THE ROMANS, KIND OF GRECO
ROMAN TIMES IT WASN'T UNUSUAL
FOR THE DOCTOR TO HAVE THOSE IN
HIS BAG.
BUT HE GOT AN IDEA ON THIS
ENSLAVED WOMAN'S BODY IF I
PERFECT THE SPECULUM, I CAN SEE
EVEN MORE AS HE WROTE I CAN SEE
AS NO MAN HAD SEEN BEFORE.
THOSE WERE HIS WORDS.
SO HE CANVASSES THE COUNTY FOR
CASES GOING TO OWNERS ASKING
THEIR PERMISSION.
I WILL TAKE ON THESE WOMEN
SUFFERING FROM THIS MALADY.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY, AND
ONCE I'M FINISHED THEY WILL BE
CURED.
THEY'LL BE REPAIRED.
SO HE DOES SO.
AND ONCE AGAIN I'M POINTING TO
MY FAR RIGHT, YOU'LL SEE THE
STOREFRONT IN MONTGOMERY ALABAMA
WHERE HE BEGINS HIS EXPERIMENTAL
SURGERIES.
AND THERE WERE ABOUT A HALF A
DOZEN A LITTLE MORE THAN HALF A
DOZEN ENSLAVED WOMEN AND WE HAVE
ONLY FOUND THE REMAINS OF THREE
OF THEM.
AND SO HE STARTS THE
EXPERIMENTAL SURGERY.
HE USES THE SUTURE METHOD THAT
WAS TALKED ABOUT MED SUTURE
DIDN'T GO HIS WAY.
TWO WHITE MALE SURGICAL
ASSISTANTS ASSISTING HIM
LEARNING FROM HIM AFTER TWO
YEARS OF FAILED EXPERIMENTS THEY
QUIT.
THIS IS AFTER THEY HAD GIVEN
PUBLIC VIEWINGS OF HIS SURGERIES
THE ENSLAVED WOMEN WERE NAKED.
THEIR BODIES WERE IN VIEW OF THE
PUBLIC WHO WAS INVITED.
AND SO THESE TWO WHITE MEN QUIT.
SO SIMMS DOES WHAT ANY OTHER
SLAVE OWNER DOES; HE TELLS HIS
ENSLAVED PATIENTS THEY MUST NOW
WORK AS ASSISTANTS.
THIS IS WHERE IT BECOMES
INTERESTING.
NOW, THE REIGNING SCIENTIFIC
BELIEF IS THAT BLACK PEOPLE LIVE
IN A STATE OF ARRESTED
DEVELOPMENT INTELLECTUALLY.
AND WOMEN IN FACT WERE NOT
LOGICAL BECAUSE WOMEN THOUGHT.
AND SO SIMMS TRAINED THESE
ENSLAVED WOMEN IN THE SAME WAYS
THAT HE WAS TRAINED ON WHITE
CERVICAL ASSISTANTS.
AND THIS IS REALLY IMPORTANT.
REMEMBER I SAID I HAD TO READ
THE SOURCES DIFFERENTLY.
RIGHT, FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF
THE ENSLAVED WOMAN AND NOT THE
ENSLAFR.
AND I THOUGHT WHY WOULD HE DO
THIS?
AND THESE WOMEN WERE LITTLE.
WELL, BECAUSE THEY WERE SMART.
PEOPLE KNEW THAT.
THESE WERE HUMAN BEINGS CAPABLE
OF THINKING, THEY WERE SMART.
AND GUESS WHAT, WITH THE
SURGICAL TEAM OF ENSLAVED WOMEN
THAT'S WHEN HE GOT THE TREATMENT
RIGHT.
THE OTHER THING IS I OFTEN TOO
THINK ABOUT THE WAYS THAT THESE
ENSLAVED WOMEN WHO WERE FORCED
TO BUILD COMMUNITY WITH EACH
OTHER BECAUSE THEY SUFFERED FROM
THE SAME CONDITION, IS WHAT WERE
THE WAYS, IF THEY COULD, THAT
THEY MIGHT HAVE RESISTED OR
ADDED TO THE SURGICAL
DEVELOPMENT?
WE'LL NEVER KNOW, BUT I DO KNOW
SURGICAL TEAM THEY STILL
PRACTICED SOME OF THE -- THE
COMMON PRACTICES AROUND SURGERY.
NUMBER ONE BLACK PEOPLE DON'T
EXPERIENCE PAIN, SUPPOSEDLY.
AND THEN WHY WOULD YOU RESTAIN
YOUR BLACK PATIENT?
RUSH WROTE IN THAT ARTICLE THAT
I MENTIONED THAT ESSENTIALLY
BLACKNESS WAS A FORM OF LEPROSY
IN 1799.
HE WROTE KINGSLY THAT PEOPLE
WERE SO ENTRENCHED TO PAIN THEY
COULD PERFORM AMPUTATIONS, NEGRO
CAN HOLD THEIR LIMBS IN A HANDS
WITHOUT MUCH OF A SCREAM.
IF THAT WERE TRUE DOCTORS WOULD
NOT RESTRAIN, PHYSICALLY
RESTRAIN BLACK PATIENTS.
AND YET EVERY DOCTOR RESTRAINS
THEIR BLACK PATIENTS BECAUSE
THEY KNOW IT'S A FALLACY.
THEY KNOW THAT THESE FOLKS, ONCE
YOU SEE A KNIFE COMING THEY'RE
GOING TO SQUIRM, TRY TO RUN,
THEY'RE GOING TO FIGHT.
SIMMS WRITES ABOUT A PATIENT,
SHE LOST SIGHT OF HERSELF AND
STRUGGLED VIOLENTLY.
SO THERE'S THAT RACIAL PART OF
DISSONANCE.
REIGNING SCIENTIFIC BELIEF BUT
YET YOUR PRACTICE PROVES THAT
YOU BELIEVE OTHERWISE.
IN FACT, YOU KNOW THAT BLACK
PEOPLE ARE SMART.
YOU KNOW THAT THEY EXPERIENCE
PAIN.
BUT BEING WEDDED TO THAT BELIEF
BECOMES PART OF THE RACIAL
ETIQUETTE OF THE 19TH CENTURY.
SO WHEN WE THINK ABOUT THAT,
SIMMS IS ACTUALLY QUITE
TRANSPARENT AND HONEST ABOUT THE
SURGERIES, THE EXPERIMENTS, THE
RACE OF THE
PATIENT/NURSE/ASSISTANTS.
AND HE PUBLISHES.
HE PUBLISHES ARTICLES IN 1852,
ONCE THE SURGERIES ARE, THEY'RE
FINISHED AND PERFECTED HE USES A
SUTURE METHOD.
AND SO SUBSEQUENT ARTICLES
PRAISED SIMMS, THERE WAS AN
ANNIVERSARY ARTICLES, ALL OF A
SUDDEN THE NURSES WHITE, THE
PATIENT IS WHITE AND CLOTHED AND
IT PROVIDES INFORMATION TO ME AS
TO THE PROSE AND COMMENTS THAT I
HAD BEEN GIVEN ABOUT WHETHER
THERE WOULD BE ENOUGH
INFORMATION.
THERE WAS AN ERASURE THAT WAS
HAPPENING VISUALLY BUT ALSO
HISTORICALLY.
SO BY THE TIME I'M DOING
RESEARCH IN 2005 AND 6, PEOPLE
ARE REALLY SHOCKED THAT I'M
TRYING TO WRITE A HISTORY OF
AMERICAN MEDICINE FOCUSING ON
GYNECOLOGY THAT INCLUDES BLACK
PEOPLE.
SO THE LEGACY HERE FOR US IS
THINKING ABOUT HOW WE CAN READ
SOURCES AND COME TO NEW
INTERPRETATIONS AND FINDINGS
WHERE THERE'S NOT A HISTORICAL
EFFACEMENT OF BLACK PEOPLE'S
WHOA OF THE POSITIONS THEY HELD,
THE NURSES SURGERY ASSISTANT.
SO I ALWAYS POINT PEOPLE TO A
PASSAGE IN MY BOOK WHERE I
LOOKED AT 1850 CENSUS OF SIMMS.
NOW, MY FATHER WORKED AT THE
NATIONAL ARCHIVES OVER 30 YEARS.
I KNOW HOW CENSUS PRODUCTION
HAPPENS YOU DON'T JUST COLLECT
IT ON JANUARY 18, '50 AND
PUBLISH IN DECEMBER 18, '50.
IT DOESN'T WORK LIKE THAT.
AS WE KNOW, THE CENSUS IS EVERY
10 YEARS AND PEOPLE BEGIN CENSUS
RESEARCH BEFORE THEN, BEFORE THE
PUBLICATION DATE.
SO BY 1850 THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN
THE SECOND CENSUS THAT FEATURED
BLACK PEOPLE ON THE CENSUS.
OUT OF THE 17 ENSLAVED PEOPLE
THAT SIMMS OWNED 12 WERE WOMEN,
FIVE WERE CHILDREN, ALL WERE
LISTED AS NEGRO EXCEPT ONE.
THE YOUNGEST ENSLAVED PERSON ON
THAT SLAVE FARM THAT SIMMS OWNED
WAS A LITTLE GIRL BORN DURING
THE EXPERIMENTAL TRIAL.
SHE WAS THE ONLY PERSON.
THE NUMBER IN THE SOUTH IN THE
SOUTHERN NATION IS UNIQUE AND
SIMMS HAS CONTROL OF THAT
HOSPITAL.
AND IN FACT THAT MEANS THAT
EITHER SIMMS OR SOME WHITE MEN
MIGHT HAVE BEEN HER OWNER MIGHT
HAVE BEEN ONE OF THE SURGICAL
ASSISTANTS, BUT SOME WHITE MAN
HAD ACCESS TO THIS ENSLAVED
WOMAN'S BODY AND DURING AN
EXPERIMENTAL TRIAL THAT THE
ENTIRE TOWN KNEW ABOUT, THE
ENTIRE CITY KNEW ABOUT, SHE IS
PREGNANT.
AND SHE HAS THE ONLY CHILD THAT
IS MARKEDLY DIFFERENT IN
APPEARANCE THAN THE 16 OTHER
ENSLAVED PEOPLE.
AND SOMEONE SAYS WHAT ABOUT THE
MALES ALL FIVE OF THOSE MALES
WERE CHILDREN.
AND SO I WOULD NEVER KNOW THE
ANSWER OF THIS PERSON'S
PATERNITY BECAUSE THE CENSUS
DOESN'T LIST THE WOMAN'S NAME.
YOU DON'T KNOW THE NAME OF THE
CHILD.
BUT I HAVE BEEN DOING SIMPLE
ADDICTION AND SUBTRACTION.
AND THIS LITTLE GIRL IS BORN
ALSO AROUND THE TIME THAT THE
TWO SURGICAL ASSISTANTS QUIT.
AND SO WERE THERE RUMORS, WERE
THERE IDEAS OF SOMETHING
INAPPROPRIATE HAPPENING?
THAT IS A BIOMEDICAL ETHICAL
ISSUE THAT IS NOT ONE THAT IS
KIND OF RULED BY WHAT YOU THINK
IN THE 21st CENTURY BUT IS RULED
BY WHAT PEOPLE WOULD CRITIQUE IN
THE 19TH CENTURY.
SO THE LEGACY OF THIS, RIGHT,
REPRODUCTIVE HEALTH FOR ENSLAVED
WOMEN IN PARTICULAR WAS OF
UTMOST IMPORTANCE BECAUSE
EVERYBODY WAS INTERESTED IN A
TEAM OF OBSERVING SLAVERY KNOWS
THAT YOU HAVE TO HAVE RELATIVELY
HEALTHY RACE.
BUT FREEDOM COMES LITERALLY FROM
THINGS CHANGE.
AND SO WE HAVE THIS LEGACY OF
MEDICAL RACISM AND ANTI
BLACKNESS THAT HAPPENS WHERE
DECADE AFTER DECADE AND FREEDOM,
BLACK WOMEN HAVE HIGHER RATES OF
DEATH AND COMPLICATIONS FROM
PREGNAN
PREGNANCY AND CHILDBIRTH.
SO THE RATES OF MORTALITY AND
MORBIDITY ARE VERY HIGH.
SAME GOES FOR THEIR CHILDREN.
SO HERE A BLACK WOMAN PERSON
THREE TO FOUR TIMES MORE LIKELY
TO DIE FROM PREGNANCY RELATED
COMPLICATIONS THAN WHITE WOMEN.
DC, A PLACE WHERE MY FAMILY
STILL LIVES THAT I LOVE DEEPLY,
MATERNAL MORTALITY RATE IS
ALMOST TWO TIMES THE NATIONAL
RATE DESPITE WHAT HAPPENED IN
2014, OVER A FOUR-YEAR PERIOD.
95 PERCENT OF PREGNANCY RELATED
DEATHS IN WASHINGTON D.C.
AFRICAN-AMERICANS DESPITE
AFRICAN-AMERICANS COMPRISING
ALMOST 45% THE POPULATION.
AND MATERNAL MORTALITY RATE IN
D.C. IS COMPARED TO A NATIONAL
RATE OF 29.6%.
SO ACROSS THE BOARD.
THIS IS WHAT WAS SHOWN.
AND LITERALLY FOR ME I HAVE
GIVEN TALKS EVERY YEAR.
PITTSBURGH, KENTUCKY, BUFFALO,
CALIFORNIA, I COULD GO ON AND
ON, NEW YORK, CHICAGO, THE RATES
ARE THE SAME.
I LITERALLY JUST HAVE TO CHANGE
SOME OF THE NUMBERS BUT THE
RATES ARE THE SAME.
AND SO HOW DO WE SOLVE THIS?
RIGHT?
OKAY.
JOURNALISTS PUBLISH THEIR
ARTICLES.
HOW DO MEDICAL PRACTITIONERS
SOLVE THIS.
HOW DO WE AS A CONCERNED NATION
SOLVE THIS PROBLEM?
AND THE PROBLEM OF THE UNITED
STATES IS THE MOST DANGEROUS
PLACE FOR BLACK WOMEN TO BECOME
PREGNANT OR HAVE BABIES.
AND THIS IS COMPARED TO ALL
COUNTRY NATIONS, AND THIS HAS
BEEN IN PLACE FOR A REALLY LONG
TIME.
SO WHAT PUBLIC HEALTH OFFICIALS
ARE DOING, WHICH I THINK IS
REALLY SMART HERE, PUBLIC HEALTH
OFFICIALS ARE SAYING IT'S NOT
RACE.
IT'S IN FACT ANTI-BLACK RACISM
THAT'S CREATING THIS BIRTHING
CRISIS.
RACHEL HARDMAN, PUBLIC SCHOLAR
AT THE UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA
SCHOOL OF PUBLIC HEALTH, SHE AND
HER RESEARCH TEAM COMBED THROUGH
DOCUMENTS LOOKING FOR RESEARCH.
AND IT WAS PUBLISHED IN
JANUARY 2021 IN THE WASHINGTON
POST.
THEY FOUND A TANTALIZING
STATISTIC IN THE FORWARD OF THE
BOOK.
BLACK NEWBORNS LIKELY TO DIE AND
NEONATOLOGISTS AND
PRACTITIONERS, IT WAS CUT IN
HALF.
AND YOU COULD FIND THESE REPORTS
ACROSS MULTIPLE RESEARCH
ORGANIZATIONS.
SO THEY'RE FINDING WHEN THE
PRACTITIONERS ARE BLACK, THOSE
MORTALITY AND MORBIDITY RATES
ARE CUT IN HALF.
SO A PART OF WHAT I'M DOING AS A
HISTORIAN WHO DOESN'T WANT TO
JUST PRESENT INFORMATION, BUT
JUST TALK ABOUT THE WAYS THAT
THE SYSTEM STAYS WITH US IS TO
HAVE US REALLY THINK ABOUT THESE
HISTORICAL FIGURES NOT AS
SCIENTIFIC OBJECTS OF INQUIRY
BUT REALLY AS HUMAN SUBJECTS.
AND HUMAN SUBJECTS WHO NEEDED
CARE AND MORE IMPORTANT TO THINK
ABOUT THEIR CHILDREN'S
CHILDREN'S CHILDREN, THE
DESCENDANTS AS PEOPLE WHO
DESERVE CARE AND PROTECTION SO
THAT WE CANNOT CONTINUE ON WITH
THESE REALLY HARD STATISTICS I
THANK YOU AND WELCOME YOUR
COMMENTS AND YOUR QUESTIONS AND
I'M GOING TO STOP SHARING MY
SCREEN.
>> THANK YOU, DR. COOPER OWENS.
FANTASTIC, WONDERFUL
PRESENTATION.
TO THOSE WHO ARE LISTENING,
THERE'S A LIVE FEEDBACK BUTTON
JUST UNDER THE VIDEO AND YOU'RE
WELCOME TO SEND QUESTIONS TO ME
THROUGH THAT LIVE FEEDBACK
BUTTON THEY'LL ARRIVE IN MY
E-MAIL I'LL TURN THEM AROUND TO
DR. OWENS.
WE HAVE A FEW THANK YOU SO MUCH
FOR THIS FASCINATING VERY
ENLIGHTENING LECTURE THE
QUESTION IS WHEN SIMMS HAD BLACK
WOMEN WHO WERE ALSO PATIENTS
WORKING AS SURGICAL ASSISTANTS,
IS THERE ANY INFORMATION ABOUT
HOW THEY BEHAVED TOWARD EACH
OTHER DURING THE SURGICAL
PROCEDURES?
IT SEEMS INTUITIVE THAT THEY
WOULD SUPPORT EACH OTHER AND BE
MORE COMPASSIONATE THAN THE
WHITE MALE SURGICAL ASSISTANTS
WHO HAD LEFT.
DOES SIMMS OR ANYONE WHO
OBSERVED HIS PROCEDURES COMMENT
ON THIS IN THE HISTORICAL
RECORD?
>> NO.
SO THIS IS -- THAT'S SUCH AN
IMPORTANT QUESTION.
THANK YOU TO WHOEVER POSED THAT
QUESTION SUCH AN IMPORTANT
QUESTION BECAUSE IT POINTS US
BACK TO THE IMBALANCE WHEN WE
THINK ABOUT THESE SOURCES HERE I
AM, WOMEN'S HISTORY AND SLAVERY
AND YET ALMOST ALL OF THE
SOURCES THAT I LOOK AT THAT I
VIEWED ARE WRITTEN BY WOMEN WHO
TREATED THESE WOMEN IN THE ERA
OF SLAVERY.
AND SO I HAVE TO EXTRACT
INFORMATION REMEMBER TO PHRASE
IT AS IT WAS SIMMS WROTE ABOUT
ONE OF THE ENSLAVED WOMEN LOSING
SIGHT OF HERSELF BECAUSE SHE
RESISTED VIOLENTLY TOWARD THAT.
THAT'S JUST A PHRASE.
I DON'T EVEN REMEMBER IF IT'S A
COMPLETE SENTENCE, BUT FOR ME
THE PHRASE BECOMES IMPORTANT
BECAUSE I'M ABLE TO NOW READ
AGAINST THE GRAIN, BECAUSE THESE
WOMEN DIDN'T LEAVE RECORDS IT
WAS ILLEGAL FOR THEM TO BE
FORMALLY EDUCATED.
AND SO THAT'S WHERE THE
SPECULATIVE COMES INTO U.S.
HISTORY, HISTORY OF SLAVERY.
I DON'T HAVE ANY SHAME I THINK
SPECULATIVE ASPECT ALLOWS US TO
COME UP WITH REALLY GREAT
QUESTIONS MUCH LIKE YOURS.
WE MAY NOT KNOW THE ANSWER BUT
WE CAN AT LEAST ASSUME FROM SOME
OF THE MONOGRAPHS AND STUDIES
THAT HAVE COME OUT I THINK OF
WORKING CURES BY CHARLOTTE PHAT
AND RETHAT SCHWARTZ BIRTH OF A
SLAVE SOME OF THOSE KINDS OF
WORKS.
I REALLY THINK ABOUT THE WAYS
THEY WRITE ABOUT COMMUNITY AND
THE KINDS OF COMMUNITY THAT
ENSLAVED PERSONS HAD TO CREATE I
THINK IT'S A GOOD POINT PART OF
THE NURTURING MIGHT HAVE LED TO
GENTLER CARE AS THEY LABORED
UNDER SIMMS.
>> THANK YOU.
SO I'M GOING TO PIGGYBACK ON
PART OF WHAT YOUR RESPONSE WAS
TO ASK YOU THIS NEXT QUESTION
ABOUT SOURCES.
AMONG ALL OF THE HISTORICAL
SOURCES YOU HAVE EXPLORED TO
REVEAL THESE STORIES IN SOME
CASES NOT REVEAL THEM FROM TEXTS
TO IMAGES TO ARTIFACTS,
REFERENCE THAT IN YOUR TALK.
ARE THERE ONE OR MORE THAT ARE
MOST NOTABLE IN YOUR MIND OR
REMARKABLE AND FOR WHAT REASON?
AND THE ASK OF THIS QUESTION
SAYS ARE THERE PARTICULAR AHA
MOMENTS THAT YOU HAD THAT YOU
WOULD LIKE TO SHARE AHA MOMENTS
DRAWN FROM PERHAPS A SILENCE IN
A SOURCE OR NOT A SILENCE.
>> AND SO IT'S THE ONE WHERE I
TALKED ABOUT THE 1850 CENSUS.
I LITERALLY WAS IN DC.
I WENT TO UC LA.
I DID EVERYTHING I COULD TO GET
TO TWO PLACES TO DO RESEARCH MY
FAMILY IS THERE AND OTHER IS
SOUTH CAROLINA, I GREW UP IN
SOUTH CAROLINA AS WELL I
REMEMBER MY MOTHER AT THE FAMILY
HISTORIAN SHE DOES A LOT OF
GENEALOGY.
I WANT TO COME BELONG FINE
MOTHER LET'S GO WE GO TO THE
NATIONAL ARCHIVES IN D.C. NOT
COLLEGE PARK.
AND I'M LOOKING AT THE
MICROFICHE, AND WHO HADN'T
WRITTEN ABOUT THE 1850 CENSUS
WITH REGARD TO SIMMS.
BUT THEY ALWAYS WROTE ABOUT IT
AS, OH, WELL, HE OWNED 17
ENSLAVED PEOPLE AND SO THEY
ATTACHED IT TO -- HE WASN'T
WEALTHY BUT I WASN'T INTERESTED
IN SIMMS.
I WAS INTERESTED IN THOSE
ENSLAVED PEOPLE.
AND SO IT WAS [INAUDIBLE] IT WAS
THIS MOLATO BABY AND I HAD TO
HOLD IT AS A PH.D. STUDENT YOU
HAD TO HOLD IT WHEN I PRESENTED
SOMETIMES I WOULD TELL IT
SOMETIMES I WOULDN'T BUT I KNEW
IT HAD NEVER BEEN PUBLISHED
BEFORE SO IT WAS A MOMENT FOR ME
ESPECIALLY AS A PROFESSOR NOW TO
TEACH STUDENTS HOW TO READ
SOURCES.
JUST FOR ME LOOKING AT IT NOT IN
TERMS OF HIS WEALTH.
I DIDN'T LOOK THE AT IT FOR
CLUES ABOUT SIMMS I LOOKED AT
THE SOURCE CLUES ON THE
ENSLAVED.
AND GUESS WHAT I FOUND?
THIS WHOLE LITTLE HUMAN BEING
WHO NO ONE WROTE ABOUT.
THE OTHER AHA MOMENT FOR ME WAS
I WAS IN THE SOUTH CAROLINIAN
LIBRARY AT THE UNIVERSITY OF
SOUTH CAROLINA, I CAN TELL YOU
SOMETIMES THE RESEARCHERS BORING
YOU'RE JUST LIKE HOW MANY
NUMBERS DO I HAVE TO SEE IN THIS
LEDGER?
AND THEN I STARTED TO SEE A
PATTERN EMERGE BECAUSE REMEMBER
THIS IS NOT FOR ME.
I'M NOT A HISTORIAN OF SIMMS.
I'M AN HISTORIAN OF GYNECOLOGY,
HISTORY OF MEDICINE AND SLAVERY.
I'M TRYING TO THINK ABOUT THIS
MORE BROADLY.
AND SO I'M SEEING IN THESE SLAVE
LEDGERS IT LOOKED LIKE THERE'S A
APPRENTICESHIP THAT'S GOING ON
SO YOU WOULD SEE THE NAME OF A
NURSE YEAR AFTER YEAR AND THEN
NEXT THING YOU KNOW YOU SEE THE
NAME OF A NURSE SO SOMETIMES
THEY WOULD SAY OPEG NEW PEG
NURSE LIZZY.
AND I'M THINKING OH, MY GOSH
THERE'S APPRENTICESHIP THAT'S
GOING ON AND FOR VERY LONG TIME
ENSLAVERY ONLY ENSLAVED MEN WERE
SKILLED LABORERS NOT ENSLAVED
WOMEN, BUT I'M SAYING WAIT THEY
WERE THESE WOMEN'S VALUE
INCREASED AND THEY'RE ALSO
TRAINING FOLK AFTER SEVERAL
YEARS SO THAT WAS ALSO AN AHA
MOMENT WHERE EVEN THOUGH IT'S
NOT THE MAIN FOCUS, PUT IN A
SENTENCE OR TWO AROUND THAT
ISSUE AND SAY WE ALSO NOW HAVE
TO THINK ABOUT WHAT SKILLED
LABOR MEANT.
AND I DON'T THINK YOU FIND A
HISTORIAN OF SLAVERY WHO WOULD
ARGUE TODAY THAT BEING A MIDWIFE
OR NURSE IN A SLAVE COMMUNITY IS
NOT SKILLED LABOR.
>> I WANTED TO SHARE A COMMENT
THANK YOU FOR SHARING THIS
INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT AND
POWERFUL WORK YOU'RE GIVING
VOICE TO THESE ENSLAVED WOMEN
GIVING BACK A BIT OF DIGNITY
TELLING THEIR STORIES HOPEFULLY
THE MEDICAL FIELD CAN LEARN FROM
THIS.
>> THANK YOU THANK YOU.
>> WE HAVE A QUESTION THANK YOU
FOR THIS VERY INTERESTING AND
INFORMATIVE LECTURE DR. COOPER
OWENS.
AS A BLACK FEMALE STARTING
MEDICAL SCHOOL THIS FALL, THIS
LECTURE AND INFORMATION IS SO
IMPORTANT FOR ALL FUTURE DOCTORS
TO KNOW ABOUT.
DO YOU THINK RACISM IN THE
MEDICAL FIELD STILL PERSISTS
TODAY?
AND EXPLAINS WHY THERE'S STILL A
DISPARITY IN THE NUMBER OF BLACK
PHYSICIANS IN THE UNITED STATES?
>> YEAH. [CHUCKLING].
YES.
I MEAN, I HAVE TO SAY YOU KNOW
THE RESPONSE BY THE MEDICAL
FIELD HAS BEEN OVERWHELMINGLY
POSITIVE.
HERE I AM SITTING IN AN OFFICE
AT THE UNIVERSITY OF BUFFALO
SCHOOL OF MEDICINE.
GETTING READY TO GIVE A KEYNOTE
LECTURE FOR THEIR DEPARTMENT OF
SURGERY.
AND THAT'S NOT AN UNCOMMON
INVITATION FOR ME TO ACCEPT.
SCHOOLS OF NURSING, SAME THING.
SO IT'S BEEN AT LEAST FROM THIS
SIDE OF THINGS, IT'S BEEN
PROMISING, BUT I MUST SAY I WAS
REALLY BROUGHT TO THE FORE IN
THIS KIND OF CONVERSATION WITH
MEDICAL PRACTITIONERS BECAUSE OF
THE WORK OF BLACK JEWELLERS AND
MIDWIVES LIVING IN NEW YORK.
THESE WOMEN KNEW MY WORK WE HAVE
PLACED IT ON THE SYLLABUS WHEN
WE'RE TRAINING DULAS COME AND
TALK LET'S TALK ABOUT YOUR
RESEARCH, LET'S FORM
PARTNERSHIPS.
AND SO THEY WERE REALLY THE ONES
KIND OF TWO OR THREE STEPS AHEAD
OF OF THE GAME.
AND THEN IT WAS UNTIL ABOUT LAST
YEAR OR SO THAT THE SCHOOLS AND
THE ORGANIZATIONS ACOG, NATIONAL
-- WAS IT I FORGET THE ACRONYM,
I THINK IT MIGHT BE NCNW FOR THE
NURSE MIDWIVES.
BUT ALL OF THESE ORGANIZATIONS
START TO COME IN A CAN YOU HELP
US WITH LEARNING MODULES.
SO THE SCHOOLS ARE AWARE.
THEY'RE TRYING TO MAKE SOME
STRUCTURAL CHANGES.
AND I'M JUST HOPEFUL IT WON'T GO
AWAY THAT THESE WILL BE
CONSIDERED COURSES THAT ARE
REQUIRED AND NOT JUST ELECTIVE
COURSES.
SO I'M DOING MY BEST.
I ACT AS A CONSULTANT FOR MANY
OF THEM IN TERMS OF CURRICULUM
DESIGN AND REDESIGN.
SO KEEPING MY FINGERS CROSSED.
>> THANK YOU.
SO LET'S SEGUE INTO A QUESTION
ABOUT CURRICULUM.
OUTSTANDING TALK.
THIS INDIVIDUAL WRITES AND DO
YOU HAVE ANY IDEAS OR EXPERIENCE
WITH INTEGRATING THIS INTO
MEDICAL STUDENTS' CURRICULUM.
MAYBE YOU CAN TALK ABOUT MORE
ABOUT THIS FOR THIS PARTICULAR
LISTENER.
>> ONE OF THE SCHOOLS.
SO IT'S IRONIC, ONE OF THE
SCHOOLS WHERE I FELT --
CURRICULUM DESIGN AND LEARNING
MODULES JEFFERSON MEDICAL
COLLEGE, THAT'S SIMMS' ALMA
MATER.
YOU CAN IMAGINE, THEY ARE REALLY
INTERESTED IN DEI ISSUES,
CHANGING THE CURRICULUM TO BE
MORE AWARE AND REFLECTIVE OF
THESE KINDS OF HISTORIES MORE
CULTURALLY CENTERED, CLINICAL
PRACTICE MODELS.
I'VE DONE SOME WORK IN TERMS OF
THE CALIFORNIA STATE BOARD OF
HEALTH, WITH HELPING THEM TO
CONTEXTUALIZE THROUGH HISTORY
THE WAY THESE DISPARITIES CROP
UP AND HOW WE CAN POTENTIALLY
CHANGE THOSE NUMBERS.
I'VE WORKED WITH MY GOODNESS
DULA ORGANIZATIONS IN TERMS OF
THEIR CURRICULUM WITH THEIR
PARTNERSHIPS, PARTICULARLY IN
NEW YORK WITH MOMMA GLOW
ANCESTRAL SPIRITS, SHANEL
PORSCHE IN -- OH, MY GOSH, IT'S
ESCAPED ME I'VE WORKED WITH SO
MANY PLACES, LARGE PART IS I'M
ALWAYS LIKE YOU ALL CAN READ
BOOKS FROM THE HUMANITIES SOCIAL
SCIENCES ON THE HISTORY OF
MEDICINE I PROMISE YOU IT WON'T
TAKE YOU THAT FAR OFF COURSE.
SO I WOULD SAY JUST
INCORPORATING THOSE THINGS, BUT
ALSO HAVING REALLY CULTURAL
SENSITIVE LEARNING MODELS AND A
LOT OF FOLKS IN THE AGE OF COVID
ARE DOING THAT VIA THESE VISUAL
LEARNING MODULES SO THAT
STUDENTS CAN ACCESS THEM AT ANY
TIME AND ALSO FACULTY MEMBERS
TOO.
SO THAT HAS BEEN SOMETHING
THAT'S BEEN REALLY HELPFUL AS
WELL.
>> THANK YOU.
YOU MENTIONED NEW YORK, OF
COURSE, IN YOUR TALK.
THIS COMES UP IN THE NEXT
QUESTION.
SOMEONE WRITES IN I'M AN OB/GYN
PRACTICED IN SOUTH CAROLINA FOR
15 YEARS, JM SIMMS HAS BUILDINGS
NAMED AFTER HIM THERE.
HE ALSO SPENT TIME IN NEW YORK
CITY.
A STATUE OF HIM ON FIFTH AVENUE
WAS REMOVED WITHIN THE LAST FEW
YEARS.
SEEMED TO ME HE MOVED AROUND A
LOT.
WAS THIS JUST CAREER ADVANCEMENT
OR WAS HE RUNNING FROM SOMETHING
DUE TO HIS BEHAVIOR IN WHICH YOU
POINT OUT MAY HAVE BEEN
ETHICALLY QUESTIONABLE DURING
THAT TIME.
>> NO, HE WASN'T RUNNING FROM
ANYTHING.
IN FACT, HE WAS LAUDED.
I WAS BORN IN THE LOW COUNTRY
AND DC UP COUNTRY, I WENT TO
MIDDLE SCHOOL IN IF SOUTHEAST.
TEACHERS FROM HOMETOWN SOUTH
CAROLINA.
HE WAS BORN IN SOUTH CAROLINA.
SETS UP PRACTICE.
THE ONLY TIME HE WAS RUNNING
FROM SOMETHING, AND I DO THINK
THERE'S A FACT THAT I NEED TO
INSERT IN HERE.
HE DOES LEAVE SOUTH CAROLINA AND
HE MOVES TO ALABAMA, BECAUSE TWO
NEGRO INFANTS DIED UNDER HIS
CARE.
AND SO PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO
WANT -- THEY DON'T WANT TO GO TO
A DOCTOR WHERE PATIENTS DIE.
AND 19TH CENTURY MEDICINE
SOMETIMES IT WAS BEST NOT TO GO
TO A DOCTOR IN 19TH CENTURY
BECAUSE YOU HAD A WORSE OUTCOME.
THIS IS BEFORE GERM THEORY.
BUT BY THE TIME HE GOES TO MOVES
TO ALABAMA, OH, HE'S WELL
RESPECTED.
WHICH IS HOW HE'S ABLE TO GO TO
NEW YORK AND GET THE INVESTORS
SO THAT HE CAN OPEN UP THIS
HOSPITAL.
HE TRAVELS TREATING RICH PEOPLE
GLOBAL AND HE'S NOT RUNNING FROM
ANYTHING HE'S LAUDED DURING LIFE
AND AFTER DEATH HIS COLLEAGUES
WAS HE WAS THE FATHER OF
AMERICAN GYNECOLOGY.
SO THAT'S THE THING.
SIMMS LIVED A CHARMED LIFE.
I OFTEN THINK ABOUT THE WOMEN.
NOT JUST THAT SIMMS EXPERIMENTED
ON, BUT LIKE ALL OF THE WOMEN
THAT I WRITE ABOUT SPREAD ACROSS
THE SLAVE HOLDING SOUTH.
I WONDER ABOUT HOW THEY REJOIN
THEIR COMMUNITIES, WHETHER THEY
WERE EMOTIONALLY PSYCHOLOGICALLY
INTACT AND UNFORTUNATELY WE
DON'T GET ENOUGH IN TERMS OF THE
RECORDS THAT GIVES US
COMPLETION.
SO ALL I CAN DO AS SOMEONE SAID,
ALL I CAN DO IS MY BEST TO
REALLY PRESENT THEM IN A
THREE-DIMENSIONAL WAY TO SHOW
PEOPLE THAT THEY WERE SMART AND
THEY WERE DIGNIFIED EVEN LIVING
IN A WORLD THAT DIDN'T ACCORD
THEM DIGNITY THEY HELD
THEMSELVES TO A STANDARD AND I
HOPE THAT COMES THROUGH ON THE
PAGES.
>> YOUR BOOK CERTAINLY DOES.
WE HAVE ONE FINAL QUESTION.
AND THIS IS SOMETHING THAT YOU
DIDN'T SPEAK ABOUT TOWARD THE
END OF YOUR PRESENTATION BUT
MAYBE WE CAN UNPACK THIS A
LITTLE BIT MORE.
THANK YOU FOR THIS WONDERFUL
PRESENTATION, THIS LISTENER
WRITES SOME PARTS DEFINITELY
HOME BEING A BLACK FEMALE WHOSE
INTEREST IN OB/GYN CAME BETWEEN
THE INTERSECTION OF ETHICS
MEDICINE SOCIAL DETERMINANTS OF
HEALTH DISPARITIES WITHIN
MINORITY COMMUNITIES ARE OFTEN
DISCUSSED HOWEVER WOULD YOU
ADDRESS THESE CONCERNS BE PUT
INTO ACTION TO MAKE CHANGE.
WHETHER YOU COULD TALK MORE
ABOUT THAT CONCLUDE ON VERY
IMPORTANT NOTE.
>> THANKS FOR SHARING THAT.
I THINK IT'S REALLY ABOUT
LISTENING TO BLACK PEOPLE.
AND LISTENING TO WHAT THEY'RE
SAYING, ACCORDING THEM THE
RESPECT THEY DESERVE.
I OFTEN SAY THE PERSON WHO
TALKED ABOUT RUNNING, SOMETIMES
I FEEL LIKE I'M ALWAYS RUNNING
BECAUSE I'M DELIVERING IN ALL
THESE PLACES I REMEMBER WHEN I
WAS IN MISSISSIPPI CONSIDERED
ONE OF THE FATTEST STATES IN THE
NATION IN TERMS OF BMI AND ALL
THAT STUFF.
AND SO AS I'M DOING THIS, I'M
THINKING, WAIT, THERE ARE LOTS
OF FAT WHITE WOMEN.
AND I DON'T WANT ANYBODY TO
SUFFER FROM INFANT MORTALITY OR
MORBIDITY OR THEIR OWN MORTALITY
AND MORBIDITY RELATED TO BIRTH.
THERE'S ALL THESE FAT WHITE
PEOPLE AROUND HERE WHO HAVE THE
SAME CONDITIONS AS THE BLACK
FOLK AND YET BLACK PEOPLE, WOMEN
AND CHILDREN ARE DYING AT THESE
ALARMING RATES.
I'M LIKE NUMBER ONE WHAT IF WE
LISTEN TO THEM AND DON'T ASSUME
THAT THEY ARE PATHOLOGICAL OR
CRIMINAL.
IF SOMEONE TELLS YOU I'M IN PAIN
THEY'VE LIVED IN THAT BODY A
LONG TIME SO THEY UNDERSTAND
WHAT PAIN FEELS LIKE.
SO TO RESPECT THEM.
THIS NOTION THAT BLACK PEOPLE
DESIRE DRUGS AND THEY'RE TRYING
TO SOMEHOW FOOL THE MEDICAL
WORKER.
AND I OFTEN HAVE TO GO TO THE
STATS.
I'M LIKE SO THE STATS SHOW ONCE
AGAIN STATISTICALLY WHITE PEOPLE
USE MORE DRUGS. BUT IT ALSO
MAKES SENSE BECAUSE THERE'S MORE
WHITE PEOPLE IN THE UNITED
STATES THAN BLACK PEOPLE.
BUT IN TERMS OF STATISTICS,
WHITE PEOPLE USE AND RELY ON
DRUGS MORE SO THAN BLACK PEOPLE
DO.
SO ALL BLACK PEOPLE ARE
LITERALLY SAYING IS JUST TREAT
US LIKE YOU TREAT OTHER
PATIENTS.
WE'RE NOT ASKING YOU FOR YOU TO
PERFORM MAGIC, WE LITERALLY WANT
TO LIVE.
WE WANT QUALITY OF CARE.
I WAS ON THE PANEL WITH ANOTHER
WASHINGTON D.C. NATIVE, I'LL
CALL HIM DR. BEEN.
RAISED IN SEATTLE.
I FORGET HIS LAST NAME.
BUT REALLY FAMOUS GUY.
HE BECOMES A WHISTLEBLOWER
BECAUSE HE SEES THE RACIST
TREATMENT AND CLASSIST TREATMENT
OF HIS PATIENTS.
THIS MAN WENT TO HARVARD.
HE COULD HAVE TURNED A BLIND
EYE.
HE COULD HAVE TURNED AWAY, I
APOLOGIES FOR THAT STATEMENT, HE
COULD HAVE TURNED AWAY, HE
REPORTED IT.
WHAT HE WAS ABLE TO DO WAS, I
DON'T KNOW HOW HE COZIED UP TO
JEFF BEZOS AND THOSE
BILLIONAIRES BUT HE WAS ABLE TO
GET THE SEATTLE CITY GOVERNMENT
TO AGREE WITHIN THE NEXT THREE
OR FOUR YEARS TO NOT CRIMINALIZE
ANY YOUTH BEYOND 18 BECAUSE
THAT'S CONSIDERED CHILD ABUSE.
HE DID THIS AS A BLACK
PEDIATRICIAN.
IF YOU'RE UNDER THE -- THE AGE
OF 18 OR UNDER YOU CANNOT BE
ARRESTED AND PENALIZED AND SENT
TO PRISON OR DETENTION CENTER.
THAT'S ONE OF THE WAYS TO SAVE
OUR CHILDREN.
I THINK WE NEED TO PUT COMMUNITY
MEMBERS ON THESE ADVISORY BOARDS
AND NOT THINK ABOUT BOARD
MEMBERS AS JUST DONATING WEALTH
OR HAVING WEALTH BUT ACTUALLY
PUT PEOPLE FROM THE COMMUNITY
THERE, CHANGE THE CURRICULUM AS
I SPOKE TO BEFORE, LISTEN TO
BLACK PATIENTS.
AND RECOGNIZE THAT RACE IS NOT A
BIOLOGICAL CONSTRUCT.
I'M CONSTANTLY TELLING PEOPLE
THAT.
IT'S NOT A BIOLOGICAL CONSTRUCT.
SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS SOME FOLK
WHO BELIEVE IN IT ALSO HAVE TO
DIVORCE THEMSELVES FROM THIS
BELIEF THAT BIOLOGICAL
DISTINCTIVENESS EXISTS.
IT DOESN'T.
SO A, I DON'T KNOW HOW TO CHANGE
PEOPLE'S HEARTS BUT AT LEAST I
KNOW HOW WE CAN USE FACTUAL
INFORMATION TO CHANGE THEIR
PRACTICES.
OH, AND THE LAST THING, I THINK
THAT THERE SHOULD BE SOMETHING
PUNITIVE THAT IS ENFORCED IN
THESE HOSPITALS AND WITH THESE
DOCTORS WHO KEEP BREAKING THE
RULES AND WHO KEEP PRODUCING THE
SAME STATS.
SOMETHING HAS TO GIVE.
AND PERHAPS IF THEY'RE PUNISHED
LOSING LICENSE, PLAYING HUGE
FINES, THEN THEY'LL START PAYING
ATTENTION.
>> THANK YOU.
THANK YOU FOR ALL OF THAT.
ON THE SUBJECT OF LISTENING, I
KNOW THAT I AND THE MORE THAN
400 INDIVIDUALS WHO TUNED IN
THIS AFTERNOON HAVE ENJOYED AND
APPRECIATED AND VALUED LISTENING
TO YOU THIS AFTERNOON, DR. OWENS
AND THIS LECTURE LIKE ALL OF OUR
LECTURES WILL BE AVAILABLE IN
THE NIH VIDEO CAST ARCHIVE AND
YOUR LECTURE IN PARTICULAR WILL
BE SEEN BY MANY MORE AND INSPIRE
MANY MORE QUESTIONS AND MANY
MORE EXPLORATIONS OF HISTORY
THAT DESERVES TO BE REVEALED IN
ALL THE WAYS IT CAN AND ALL THE
WAYS IT DESERVES TO BE.
SO PERSONALLY I THANK YOU VERY
MUCH AND ON BEHALF OF THE
NATIONAL LIBRARY OF MEDICINE
THANKS FOR PARTICIPATING IN OUR
SERIES AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR
OUTSTANDING PRESENTATION THIS
AFTERNOON.
WE LEARNED A LOT AND WE WILL
LEARN SO MUCH MORE AS WE WATCH
IT AGAIN AND HOPEFULLY WE CAN
KEEP IN TOUCH.
>> YELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH.
THANKS EVERYONE FOR CHIMING IN
AND ASKING SUCH GREAT QUESTIONS.
>> ALL THE BEST ON YOUR NEXT
LECTURE COMING UP SOON.
>> THANKS SO MUCH.
>> TAKE CARE.
SAFE TRAVELS.
BYE.
THANK YOU AGAIN.